WiLD Conversation

Garry Ridge on The "Dumb-Ass" Way to Build Trust: Leadership Lessons from WD-40's Former CEO

In this episode of The WiLD Conversation podcast, Dr. Rob McKenna sits down with Garry Ridge, former CEO and Chairman of WD-40—a leader who transformed a household product into a global brand and one of the most admired workplace cultures in business.
Drawing from his 35-year journey at WD-40, including 25 years as CEO, Garry challenges conventional leadership norms and emphasizes the non-negotiable role of humanity in business.
Key Leadership Takeaways:
Culture is Strategy, Not a “Nice-to-Have”Garry makes it clear: a trust-based culture isn’t secondary to results. The will of the people × the strategy = results.
The Power of a “Dumb-Ass” MindsetYes, you read that right. His book Any Dumbass Can Do It underscores the idea that building strong culture isn’t rocket science, it’s about humility, courage, and consistency. This mindset invites leaders to say “I don’t know” and focus on bringing out the best in others.
Intentional Self-Awareness Is EssentialGarry asks himself often, “Am I being the person I want to be right now?” For leaders, self-awareness isn’t optional. The daily work that prevents us from offering people our “leftovers.”
Tough-Minded and Tender-Hearted LeadershipLeadership isn’t a choice between strength and empathy, it’s a both/and. Garry calls for leaders who make hard decisions and hold people accountable while also caring deeply for their people and creating psychological safety.
Measure the Data but Feel the RealityWhile data is key, Garry urges leaders to “get their shoes dirty" to walk alongside their teams and ensure the numbers reflect lived experience.
Belonging is a Shared ResponsibilityWD-40 thrived because it clearly defined its values and invited people to choose them. Culture wasn’t enforced—it was embraced by those aligned with its purpose.
Fear is the Enemy of Trust and LearningBy redefining failure as a “learning moment,” Garry removed fear from the equation. The result? A workplace where trust, experimentation, and growth could flourish.
Purpose Beyond Profit Is FuelWhat sustained Garry’s decades-long leadership? A clear, people-centered purpose: making a positive difference in the lives of others, inside and outside the company.
 

Getting It Done and Doing It Right: Leading with No-Blame Bias with CEO Alex Shootman

What if the key to trust wasn’t just character—but competence, clarity, and accountability?
In this compelling episode of The WiLD Conversation Podcast, Dr. Rob McKenna sits down with longtime friend and fellow leadership practitioner Alex Shootman, CEO of Alkami Technology and author of Done Right: How Tomorrow’s Top Leaders Get Stuff Done. What unfolds is not just a sharp exchange between two seasoned leaders—but a deeply honest conversation between old friends who have walked through leadership’s messiness, pressure, and purpose together.
With decades of experience leading turnarounds and scaling high-performing software organizations, Alex shares how he grounds his leadership in four non-delegable CEO responsibilities—and how a “No-Blame Bias” has shaped the way he builds trust, manages growth, and drives both results and culture.
Drawing from a leadership framework that values both getting it done and doing it right, Alex unpacks how clear accountability, relentless transparency, and trust as a managed business function are essential to long-term success. He reminds us that in every high-performing team, trust is breaking all the time—so we must be intentional about building it all the time.
Whether you're a CEO, an emerging leader, or someone navigating the tension between results and values, this episode offers not only practical wisdom—but a refreshing window into what happens when sharp minds, shared values, and leaders-in-process come together in authentic conversation.
 
💡 Leadership Takeaways
The CEO’s Responsibility: Strategy, values, economic outcomes, and building the right team cannot be outsourced—they must be owned and lived by the leader.
No-Blame Bias: Creating a culture of truth-telling starts with removing fear of blame. Leaders must model and reinforce this bias to build trust across the organization.
Trust as a Business Function: Trust doesn’t self-sustain. Even in high-performing organizations, it must be constantly assessed, cultivated, and rebuilt.
The Getting It Done / Doing It Right Matrix: High-impact organizations don’t reward results at the expense of values. The real culture carriers do both—and they’re celebrated by name.
Growth Breaks Things: Just like Hemingway’s “stronger at the broken places,” growth breaks teams and systems—what matters is how leaders repair and rebuild with intention.

The Courage to Fire: Why Trust in Leadership Starts with the CEO a conversation with Sam Willing

Guests: Dr. Rob McKenna & Sam WillingHost: A WiLD Conversation Podcast
Topics Covered:
The personal journey that shaped Sam’s leadership lens
Why emotional and nervous system regulation matters for leaders
The silent damage caused by misaligned executives
What the WiLD Trust Report reveals about organizational trust
How fear, pressure, and identity confusion derail even well-intentioned CEOs
What it takes to move from aspirational to actualized culture
Signs it’s time to make the hard call—and what happens after
Resources Mentioned:
WiLD Trust Platform
Dr. Rob McKenna’s Composed: The Heart and Science of Leading Under Pressure
https://www.wildleaders.org/wild-trust-index
https://info.wildleaders.org/state-of-trust-report-registration-0
 

Stephen M.R. Covey on The Currency of Trust: Why Influence Begins with Being Influenced

In this powerful episode of The WiLD Conversation, Dr. Rob McKenna sits down with Stephen M. R. Covey, best-selling author of The Speed of Trust, to explore the transformative power of trust in leadership, relationships, and organizational life. In a world marked by declining institutional confidence, Covey argues that trust isn’t just a value—it’s a measurable, learnable competency that multiplies performance and accelerates impact.
Listeners are invited into a conversation that challenges the myth that trust is soft or intangible. Covey reframes trust as a strategic imperative and leadership skill that determines how quickly we can innovate, collaborate, and lead through change. In his words, “Low trust is a tax. High trust is a dividend.”
The conversation also touches on a key paradox of influence: To lead effectively, we must first be willing to be influenced—to genuinely understand others before we expect them to follow us. As leaders model humility and create space for others to feel deeply seen and heard, they become catalysts for real trust.
🔑 Key Takeaways for Leaders:
Trust is a performance multiplier. It impacts everything—from speed and cost to employee engagement, innovation, and well-being.
Trust is learnable. It’s not a fixed trait but a developable competency that can be cultivated with intention and integrity.
To influence, be influenced. Understanding someone deeply—until they feel understood—is the doorway to earning trust and leading with impact.
Trust creates joy and energy. Neuroscience now backs what many leaders intuitively know: high-trust cultures are not only more productive, they’re more human.
 
In a world of declining trust, being trusted is a differentiator. Leaders and organizations who make trust a goal—not just a tool—gain a significant edge.

Between Courtrooms and Campuses: A President Emeritus on Trust, Tenure, and the Space Between Idealism and Reality with Alec Hill

In this deeply personal and profoundly insightful episode of The WiLD Conversation podcast, Dr. Rob McKenna sits down with Alec Hill—President Emeritus of InterVarsity, legal scholar, mentor, and cancer survivor—to explore the paradoxes of leadership across decades of both adversity and grace. From the dark corners of a broken legal system to the life-giving mission of global relief and development, Alec shares how life, leadership, and trust have evolved through personal failure, painful seasons, and ultimately, profound purpose.
This conversation is as raw as it is hopeful. Alec reflects on the power of convictional leadership in a polarized world, the loneliness of executive roles, and the anchoring influence of trusted relationships. He opens up about how surviving bone marrow cancer reframed everything—from how he listens, to how he mentors, to what really matters in leadership.
Leadership Takeaways:
The Jungle of Trust: Why your 30s and 40s might be the most disorienting time in your leadership—and what to do about it.
From Idealism to Wisdom: Navigating the shift from “I can fix everything” to “I can’t fix everyone”—and the cost of waiting too long.
The Decisive Edge: Why unresolved personnel decisions undermine trust, and how decisive action (with compassion) strengthens culture.
Resetting the Clock: How facing mortality sharpens your intuition, deepens your empathy, and clarifies what legacy you’re building.
Leading with Conviction in a Divided World: Why leaders must hold to their core values without abandoning curiosity or compassion across divides.
If you’re leading in a high-pressure environment, struggling with middle-season restlessness, or walking through the unknown—this conversation will resonate deeply.
Download the State of Trust at Work Report
Connect with WiLD Leaders: 

This Changes Lives: How Life-Giving Workplaces Create Life-Changing Ripples with Phil Goodman

In this powerful episode of The WiLD Conversation, Dr. Rob McKenna sits down with Phil Goodman, founder of Talent Realized, to explore how truly life-giving workplaces don’t just transform organizations—they change lives far beyond the office. Phil shares his journey from doubting founder to trusted advisor, and what it means to build cultures where trust, clarity, and meaningful connection take root. Together, they unpack what happens when leaders slow down, lean into conflict with composure, and prioritize relational strategy as much as business outcomes. Whether you're a founder, executive, or HR leader, this conversation offers a compelling call to reimagine the workplace as a launchpad for community transformation.
Leadership Takeaways:
Trust Is the Starting Point: Before you can build trust in your organization, you have to grapple with your own self-trust as a leader. Support systems matter—mentors, coaches, and advisors play a critical role in helping you move forward with courage.
Treat People Strategy Like Business Strategy: Phil models a fractional Chief People Officer approach—aligning people systems directly with business goals. Leadership is not just about outcomes; it's about the people who get you there.
Measure What You Say You Value: If people and culture are truly priorities, they must be monitored like any other key performance indicator. Tools like a trust index can give insight into readiness for change, retention health, and strategic timing.
Build Teams That Know Each Other: High performance requires high connection. People don’t just want to be seen for their productivity—they want to be known and valued as whole people.
Don’t Avoid the Hard Conversations: Avoiding conflict stunts growth and trust. Leaders must be equipped to have truth-filled, grace-driven conversations that deepen connection and resolve tension.
Life-Giving Cultures Ripple Outward: Healthy workplaces don’t just benefit business—they shape families, communities, and the way people show up in every area of life. Leadership is discipleship, and the workplace is a mission field.

Whole Leaders or Hollow Promises? Why Method and Measures Matter—The WiLD Way with Dr. McKenna and Sabeth Kapahu

In this power-packed episode of The WiLD Conversation, Dr. Rob McKenna and Sabeth Kapahu go beyond surface-level leadership trends and dive headfirst into a conversation that challenges how most organizations approach development.
Too often, leaders are handed tools without a method, or methods without measures. Rob boldly claims: “Both matter if we’re serious about building trust and developing whole leaders.” This episode unveils the revolutionary WiLD methodology—a transformative approach that reshapes how we think, interact, and assess in leadership.
With insights on psychological safety, strategic vulnerability, and the necessity of aligning learning and performance, Rob and Sabeth dissect the foundational shift needed in leadership development. They unpack why seeing people whole isn't a nice-to-have—it's a non-negotiable for building organizations where trust can actually grow.
🔑 Leadership Takeaways
Method Without Measures Is a Myth: Leadership development must include both a consistent methodology and meaningful assessments. Without both, growth is accidental at best.
Start at the Top, but Don’t Stop There: Real transformation starts with senior leaders who do the work, not just endorse it.
See the Story Behind the Scores: Data is essential, but context is king. Leaders must learn to interpret profiles as pieces of a complex narrative, not just numbers.
Expect Ownership, Not Just Attendance: Empower people to own their learning journey by giving development back to them—with clear expectations and support.
Create Learning Rhythms: Learning isn't a one-off event. Design a sustainable rhythm that integrates development into the day-to-day.
Lead with Strategic Vulnerability: Your job isn’t to master every assessment. Your job is to crack the door open for real conversation.
Bridge the Business and the Individual: Development isn’t about choosing between the needs of the organization and the growth of the person. It’s about connecting both with intentionality.
Watch this episode here.

Not Done Yet: Trust, Transition, and the Science of Work with Dr. Alexis Fink

In this episode of the WiLD Conversation Podcast, Dr. Rob McKenna sits down with Dr. Alexis Fink—organizational psychologist, people analytics pioneer, and trusted leader—for a conversation that’s as grounded as it is visionary.
Dr. Fink opens up about her recent transition out of a senior role as Meta VP of Analytics and Workforce Strategy—not as a retirement from the work she loves, but a graduation into the next chapter of her calling. Together, we explore how to prepare successors without holding too tightly, how trust and measurement create clarity in chaos, and why the science of work and workers must evolve to meet the fear and fragmentation facing organizations today.
With over 30 years in I/O Psychology and as the outgoing President of SIOP Society for Industrial Organization Psychology, Dr. Fink shares what it takes to build a legacy that outlives your tenure—one rooted in integrity, clarity, and compassion. Whether you’re a founder, an HR leader, or just trying to lead with intention through uncertainty, this conversation is for you.
📌 LEADERSHIP TAKEAWAYS
Succession isn’t optional: Preparing others to lead after you isn’t a side task—it’s your most lasting leadership work.
Measurement drives clarity: Defining what matters forces the hard but necessary conversations about values, strategy, and what’s possible.
Trust is earned in the in-between: Especially in uncertain times, consistent action and honest boundaries build the credibility that trust depends on.
Play it safe, miss the upside: Anxiety and fear limit innovation—leaders must create safety if they want boldness.
 
You’re not done: Leadership transitions don’t mark the end. They mark a turning point. You may leave a role, but the calling often goes with you.
🔗 Listen to: The Evolution of Leadership Development here: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-xi7h8-15bbbd2
 
🔗 Learn more: https://www.wildleaders.org/
🔗 Download the State of Trust at Work Report : https://info.wildleaders.org/state-of-trust-report-registration-0

The Trust Factor: Why Regulating Yourself May Be the Most Underrated Leadership Skill with Sam Willing

In this WiLD Conversation podcast, Dr. Rob McKenna sits down with coach and HR leader Sam Willing for an honest and courageous dialogue on what truly erodes trust in leadership: the inability to regulate ourselves in high-pressure moments.
Sam opens up about her own transformative journey through grief, healing, and nervous system work, and how it reshaped her understanding of emotional maturity in leadership. Together, they explore what Bowen Theory calls “self-differentiation”—the ability to remain emotionally steady while staying connected to others—and how it’s at the heart of trust, consistency, and psychological safety in organizations.
Through vivid examples, including “The Tale of Two CEOs,” Rob and Sam unpack why it’s not just about skills and culture-building strategies. If a leader lacks the capacity to self-regulate when it matters most, even the best intentions can fall flat. The conversation ends with a raw look at loneliness, imperfection, and identity in entrepreneurial leadership.
Leadership Takeaways:
Emotional maturity is a top driver of trust at both the personal and organizational levels.
Nervous system regulation is not a “soft skill”—it’s foundational to leading under pressure.
Leaders must do the internal work to align their values with their behaviors when it matters most.
Inconsistency and inauthenticity are trust-killers, even when paired with compelling vision and values.
Building community and a sense of identity outside of performance is essential for sustainable leadership.
🔗 Connect with Sam Willing:https://www.samwilling.com/
🔗 Learn more: https://www.wildleaders.org/
🔗 Download the report : https://info.wildleaders.org/state-of-trust-report-registration-0

Slow Down, and Secure the Future: The Power of Leading Yourself with Dr. Mark L Vincent

What if the future of your organization depends on something you’re too busy to notice?
We often think about leadership in terms of speed—making things happen, hitting targets, and pushing forward. But real, sustainable leadership isn’t just about performance. It’s about process. And process needs us to stop, reflect, and lead with intention.
In this episode, Dr. Rob McKenna and Dr. Mark L Vincent dive into why slowing down isn’t just a leadership discipline—it’s the key to long-term trust, succession, and continuity. Leaders who fail to cultivate trust don’t just risk losing people; they risk losing everything they’ve built.
✔️ Why trust is the ultimate leadership currency ✔️ How process clarity shapes the future of your business ✔️ Why self-leadership is the foundation of organizational success
If you want to build something that outlasts you, this conversation is where it starts.
Connect with Mark Vincent .
Download the State of Trust at Work Report.
Connect with WiLD Leaders to begin measuring and building trust today.